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31 August 2009 @ 02:59 pm
31.08.09 - question  
what is in the center of creative activity?

the result: a product, a creation?

the work process?
- what happens there?

--> is it taking some instrument in your own hands and shaping/ re-shaping something with it?
--> is it pressing keys on a machine, producing sounds, editing pictures on a screen?

what is the heart of the creative process?

some king of... feeling, experience? "the flow"?
- what's that?

is it being completely in the present, all concentration on the activity?
- is meditation a creative activity, then?

This entry was originally posted at http://lenija.dreamwidth.org/111354.html. Please comment there using OpenID.
Nemetean: dionysosnemetean on August 31st, 2009 02:28 pm (UTC)
I tend to say that creativity is connected to the process and rather not to the result.
you CAN be creative in even a visible way, enjoying and maintaining the 'flow' of combined mental/and or physical activities, yet possibly there remains no solid 'product' of it.
The working process towards a fix result, I would say, comes later, and consists mainly of concentration, patience and labor. It is the alchemistic 'reduction'.
Brings me to the conclusion that 'creation' in itself is independent from artistic idea(l)s and aims, yet the key is to keep those different things connected.
Sometimes it controls you and sometimes you control it (too much).
It's somewhat like walking the hege, or 'riding the snake', I suppose.
And this is when
you Can Do Anything. ;)

Scheiße, was für ein Blah! Siewissewasischmoin, eh? Hoffentlich, Junge.
Lenlenija on August 31st, 2009 03:06 pm (UTC)
I tend to say that creativity is connected to the process and rather not to the result.

Yeah, I'd say that, too, but it's too easy an answer. Because how do I know, then, if what I'm doing right now is creative activity or, well, just some activity? (You see I'm after definitions, as usual. ;)) What makes a creative activity creative, if it's not creating something - a product (and I assume that's not it)?
Or do I just have to believe that I'm always creating, no matter if there's a material proof of that?

the 'flow' of combined mental/and or physical activities

Now that's a interesting way to describe it. I think this is closer to where I'm heading (I don't know where that is, of course). Do you have some more ideas, or clarifications connected to this line of thought?
Nemeteannemetean on August 31st, 2009 03:55 pm (UTC)
*the 'flow' of combined mental/and or physical activities*

okay... in most cases "the flow" is not what others (if you care about them) or even yourself will view as the thought-of piece of art, which is later ment to be shared or shown in some way.
A process of going around that circumstance would be recording a jam session for later analysis or mere enjoyment, keeping composition scribbles and working them together in a panel to view the process itself or even to keep your notes on a subject, cut them out and glue them together to describe "your way" of creating, all subsumable under "the way is the aim".
Most of the time one won't do this, as we tend to aim for a final 'magnum opus' rather... (throwing away your notes, not being content with the rawness of something, etc.)
But it really helps if you won't get there in one step where you want your process to end. Let it rest, enjoy your progress, and then -maybe- take it up later for destillery and transformation.
The "combining" metaphor means that you a) use the force and b) have an aim. Often "the beast" jumps into the wrong direction first; the task is to get it where you want without breaking its own will. A spoiled horse will get you nowhere. And sometimes it's wild own senses will show you a path where you have not seen it first.
Nemetean: templu soareluinemetean on August 31st, 2009 03:59 pm (UTC)
Well, mental/physical also means to document your own process of thinking/ having ideas, without a strong filter.
This way you will prevent forgetting HOW you did it. (which happens to me often enough, for in the very moment all seems so clear...)
You can never notice oblivion when it's coming. If so, how would one ever willingly forget?
Nemeteannemetean on August 31st, 2009 02:32 pm (UTC)
Nochn Aspekt, kleiner und klarer-
Problem der bewussten Steuerung: Ziel darf nicht ZU exakt umrissen sein (selber oft genug erlebt).
Praktisches Beispiel- Wenn du an einen extrem präzis umrissenen Ort willst (von dem du aber natürlich nicht weißt, WO er ist) wirst du wahrscheinlich so schnell niemanden finden, der da auch hin will und dich mitnehmen kann.
Lieber in der Grobrichtung einsteigen und ab und zu aus dem Fenster schauen, ob man noch auf dem richtigen Weg ist. Und dann irgendwann umsteigen, oder so.
yuexiangyue on August 31st, 2009 03:49 pm (UTC)
What makes a creative activity creative, if it's not creating something - a product (and I assume that's not it)?

Aber es entsteht doch auch was, wenn man kreativ ist - Gedanken und Vorstellungen, Verknüpfungen und Strukturen. Die sind vielleicht erst mal nur einem selbst zugänglich, aber deswegen müssen die auch nicht zwangsläufig weniger komplex sein als irgendwas Aufgezeichnetes (wenn auch die Aufzeichnung eine Tendenz hat, alles komplexer werden zu lassen). Die Herstellung eines sicht- hör- oder was-auch-immer-baren Objekts sorgt dafür, dass andere die Kreativität anderer erleben können (wobei dieses Erlebnis selbst schon wieder kreativ sein kann)...
Sie kann fast untrennbar Teil des kreativen Prozesses sein, manchmal geht sie vielleicht auch mehr in Richtung einer Art Auf- oder Nachbereitung...
Hmmm, bla. Ich lass das erstmal so stehen, vielleicht fällt mir noch mehr ein.
taoyuan on September 2nd, 2009 12:58 pm (UTC)
ooch mann, da kommentiert man was extra in dreamwidth und die diskussion findet hier statt